April 28, 2018 at 10:46 am #58110tangoParticipant
This is a demonstration video by Slovenian based group Polenar Tactical. You’ve probably seen a few of their videos before. It is a very compressed <5min video and it is a demonstration so don’t dig too deep. This is an overview of concepts. However, it is a well produced and well executed glimpse into what a small 5 person (there is a girl!) team can accomplish and very much in line with a lot of the things we practice.
Outline of Operation:
5 person team, small arms only
1 DM (the girl), 4 riflemen
Overhead ISR, presumably radio fed to the Squad Leader
They patrol in to position to execute an L-Shaped ambush from tree cover surrounding open ground on some cardboard targets. DM initiates ambush. Riflemen bound move down to the edge of the tree line. They peel left to hook around and place their backs to the DM. Once hooked around the riflemen continue to assault though the enemy position until the end of the video.
0:15-0:22 Simulated radio comms and overhead UAV footage. This imitates something more akin to a Predator feed but we may be able to accomplish similar with civ equipment. Working on it!
0:22-0:40 First look at the team, theatrical patrolling, looking cool
0:42-0:55 Proper patrolling. Column formation coming to a halt. Silent hand signals, herringbone formation on halt for security.
0:55-1:30Some silent hand signals coordinating movement into positions. 1 rifleman moves up to maintain front security while the Squad Leader gets the DMR off to take her position. Note that she moves down the center of the herringbone formation to the squad leader to receive instruction. Properly done.
1:30-1:55Riflemen peel out of herringbone back into column and continue patrolling to their position.
1:55-2:35 Both elements patrolling to their positions. Showing scanning, guns at the ready, proper discipline.
2:35-2:40PAUSE. UAV/drone feed showing the layout of their elements. Using UP as North on the video, we now see the DMR has moved to the head of the clearing on the SW corner. She is looking down the length of the clearing at the targets. Riflemen are lined up 90° to her position at the far NE end of the clearing. Elements are in position.
2:41-2:52Elements set, Squad Leader gives command to turn safeties off via radio command. DMR must be tied into radio comms. Ambush is set.
2:53-3:03DMR takes first shot initiating the ambush. Riflemen open up on the targets with high volume fire.
3:04-3:20DMR maintains fire. Riflemen begin movement down the hill to the edge of the clearing. They do it in more of a firing skirmish line than bounding.
3:22-3:58Riflemen peel SW towards the DMR and hook around until their direction of fire is the same as the DMR.
4:00-4:22The idea here is that now they assault through the position. It gets kind of non-tactical as they have no cover, they aren’t bounding, and there’s not much coordination. They kind of do their skirmish line thing but it mostly breaks down. Like their guns
Weak Men can't be virtuous. - JBPApril 30, 2018 at 9:59 am #58142joe dirtParticipant
have you looked at the Mavic pro. High quality light weight portable drone that will fit in a back pack for about $800. I think it would work very well as an aid in patrolling and is perfect for a small civilian team.April 30, 2018 at 10:32 am #58143JohnnyMacParticipant
I know this is meant as a demo of drone integration and not general tactics, but I’ll include thoughts on both:
-from this perspective, I could see the drone being of value for periodic route recon on patrol. Set a quick halt, give the drone operator 20 minutes to get into the air and scan ahead a mile or two, continue on/react to new intel. It could make for ambushes that are between hasty and deliberate (semi-deliberate or semi-hasty?).
-deploying the DMR where they did makes sense, I would just be concerned over whether they could actually generate enough accurate fire. By having the DMR initiate the ambush, the enemy will first be alerted to that position. Another way it could be done is to have the patrol leader initiate the ambush instead. Ideally, everyone dies right away but we know that doesn’t always happen. By having the patrol leader initiate, with the high volume of fire from the main element, OP4 (that doesn’t die right away) might not even realize they are taking fire from the DMR, who is all alone…
-Depending on how the drone is used and how loud it is, it’s employment will msot likely need a bit of cat-and-mouse, where tactics change frequently to prevent the enemy from picking up patterns. Conservatively, you would only launch it from a position you feel confident will not give away your position. Aggressively, you keep it overhead during an ambush or raid. Maybe as a compromise, you can launch it just out of earshot and keep it high/only bring it in close after the ambush/raid is initiated. It would take a really experienced patrol leader to integrate comms from the drone operator while conducting an ambush/raid.
-The DMR is swinging in the breeze, so to speak. Really high risk. 2 DMRs in that position would be sweet.
-At some points, there were moving fast, props to them for fitness.
-Peeling around just seemed like a complete waste of time and way too slow. It gives the enemy too much time to do something and also gives them an easy break contact back the way they came.
-Questionable safety angles on the assault, but maybe they are a tight unit.May 1, 2018 at 7:12 am #58158MaxKeymaster
That wasn’t an ambush. Raid.
Peeling around was pointless and obscured their SBF.
Their discipline on the assault through was appalling.
Didn’t really see that they used a drone, other than for showing the schematics for purposes of the video?
Meh.May 1, 2018 at 7:13 am #58159MaxKeymaster
Oh yeah: get your fucking head out of your weapon on patrol….May 1, 2018 at 2:31 pm #58169rampantraptorParticipant
Having had to hide a number of times from drones (because Syria and bomber drones), they are noisy. If someone has one they perhaps should test how far out the drone can fly before it is audible and if the drone can make useful observations from that distance.
In urban fighting with an active front where it’s expected that the enemy is nearby a noisy drone will simply reveal there’s a guy operating it within X amount of miles (4.3 for the Mavic Pro, apparently) in God-knows-which building in the city. In a rural environment defined by surprise hit and run operations on open terrain it could blow an operation.
Maybe this is where Joe’s interest in fixed-wing drones might be worth taking note of, beyond the extra loiter time. I’ve never seen them in action, perhaps they might be quieter than the quadcopter types.
I’m not sure if civvie drone feeds are encrypted in any way, probably not, in which case there should be some very quick plan for any drone team conducting surveillance from the rear to haul ass and avoid an assault by enemy QRF or artillery, mortar, or airstrikes. Whichever they’d hit you with would probably depend on whether it’s enemy gangs or a hostile state actor, I think I mentioned it in another thread but even US Army Predator drones were having their feeds intercepted by Iraqi Shia militia using $20 Russian software.
DMR shouldn’t be alone, perhaps as part of a DMR team like Max has suggested.
Just my two cents.
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Jîn, Jiyan, AzadîMay 1, 2018 at 11:15 pm #58174JustARandomGuyParticipant
Interesting to see this video is still making the rounds….had the same discussion about it here a few years back.
"Time come Kimosabe, when good men must wear masks."
~TantoMay 2, 2018 at 4:59 pm #58182RobertParticipant
Realize they are not technically “AK’s” but the manipulations are the same. And dude #2 on the “assault” had the worst AK reload I think I’ve ever seen. This is the kind of guy that AK operators hate because they are used for the basis of the AK “is slow to reload” fake news.
The chic operating by herself- yeah not the best possible scenario but that’s life huh?
When we find ourselves well supplied, shoulder to shoulder with thousands of like minded comrades overtaking the BG’s easily while fighting in the shade, we will realize we are in Elysium and we are already dead… LOL
RMP, TC3, NODF, CRCD 6/14, CP 9/14. NODF, Land Nav, 6/15. Rifleman Challenge 9/15- Vanguard. FOFtactics 3/16, 10/16, 11/16, 6/17,11/17 CTT, 6/15, 11/16, , LRMC-1 9/17 GA Mobile CTT and DA 10/16, GA mobile DCH 3/18, HEAT1 3/18 Alum weekend 8/18, Opfor CLC 10/18, DA 11/18 CQBC 12/18May 6, 2018 at 9:38 am #58219BrothersKeeperParticipant
On a side note, my wife has ancestors from Slovenia, and we visited the country back in October 2013. Beautiful country. I’m sure we will go back and I was hoping to visit with the jokers of Polenar tactical and pass on some MVT tips to them.
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