July 1, 2014 at 6:28 pm #6884
The Battle for Marjah is an HBO film. As a good example of modern light infantry operations, it is full of useful tidbits of different tactics conducted by the Marines in Afghanistan. Due to restrictive rules of engagement, air support is generally limited to ISR assets and medevac, that put the Marines on a more equal footing with the Gs. Excellent combat footage with coverage of fire and movement, urban assault, room clearing, IED, counter-sniper, intel and civil affairs tactics. I highly recommend the 1 hour vid.
The only easy day was yesterdayJuly 2, 2014 at 10:27 am #6910
One part of that movie left me with questions about why the captain had the engineer (kia) move did he have any security, was he killed by a single shot or was the Tali able to walk rounds into a solitary man with his arms full of gear and no one there to RTR
Tactical training for Liberty, Fraternity, ExcellenceJuly 2, 2014 at 1:30 pm #6914
Rob, we obviously can’t know for certain. Capt. Sparks obviously felt that the request merited a risk. He may not have known how heavy the fire was on that unit. The fog of war creates opportunities and risks, right? I think as CC he has to keep the momentum going or even worse casualties are a possibility. It sounded like the guy was shot in the back. We have to wonder if he had both plates on. If they were taking fire, did his unit support his movement by fire? A sniper would love that kind of a target, burdened and slow moving. Since we are all potential unit leaders we have to be prepared to make those kinds of decisions. Tough stuff.
The only easy day was yesterdayJuly 16, 2014 at 10:20 am #7428AnonymousInactive
Sometimes its just a roll of the dice. You can be a super highspeed seal and get wacked by a 14 year old kid blind firing. You just never know. The uncomfortable truth is we train only so that we can control things we can control. The shit sandwich is that most of combat we cant control.July 16, 2014 at 7:00 pm #7439AnonymousInactive
Aaron puts his finger on a really important point IMO and I want to spin this out a bit further for us preppers:
Even if you are up against very well trained guys in super shape as long as you have tactical surprise or manage some other powerful advantage due to terrain or other factors you can be successful as long as you are well trained enough to recognize and react to opportunities.
And those will come along no matter who you are up against.
A lot of folks in the prepper community sometimes seem to say..”I am so out fo shape even if I do trian some what good will it do if I am up against (insert super high speed org here)”
The answer to that is:
– Chances are you will never be up to those folks in a collapse situation and the moderate to decent shape you can still get into as a 60 year old and the basic infantry knowledge you can get from MVT should allow you overmatch most everyone else you might encounter in a collapse situation.
And in the very unlikely event you might encounter a rogue team of some kind that overmatches you in ability/shape then at least this training will give you the intellectual tools to recognize the tactical opportunities that are bound to come along , especially on terrain you will know better than them.July 17, 2014 at 7:34 pm #7493
Maybe I’m just left wondering the psychology of the shooter, if he sees the person moving and he has security covering him does his marksmanship deteriorate? My guess yes since I assume the MC does an OK job at RTR (I’ll bet they don’t do enough). Not everyman is a Carlos Hathcock, though to give credit the one guy with the Mauser did ok but he had a sniper position where I assume the shooter here was in regular cover so to speak.
Tactical training for Liberty, Fraternity, ExcellenceJuly 17, 2014 at 9:24 pm #7494
Rob, it sounds to me you’ve touched on the eternal question facing the infantryman: does he have the courage to pull the trigger? There are combat veterans on this forum who can speak to this more directly. Throughout the movie and as our vets will tell you, finding the threat is no easy task. In his book, “On Killing”, LTC Grossman speaks of a reluctance in some troops to actually kill. I’ve never heard of an Afghan with that issue, although it is entirely possible. I’ve heard tell, the Taliban are somewhat fond of spray and pray. In Marjah, there were several firefights where this is most definitely not the case. I would hope that a unit ordered to engage a target would do so, even if threatened with effective return fire. At some point in a conflict, losses will be taken. We always think it won’t be us, right? See Aaron’s comment above. If someone is coming to take your women and rape your dogs, I’m guessing most of us won’t have too much problem doing the deed, return fire or not.
The only easy day was yesterdayJuly 17, 2014 at 11:11 pm #7497Joe (G.W.N.S.)Moderator
I’ve heard tell, the Taliban are somewhat fond of spray and pray. In Marjah, there were several firefights where this is most definitely not the case.
When we first went to Afghanistan the older Afghan’s that had fought and survived the Russians were pretty squared away. The younger ones that had only fought each other were more of the “spray and pray” type.
There is kind of an OJT process, the “spray and pray” types either learn better through experience or die. The ones that fought us and survived, learn relatively fast what works as well as how to exploit out ROE.
We would see the same here, how many idiots with their tacticool methods would live long enough to learn better? It’s a steep learning curve, but people adapt fast or die.
As Aaron pointed out, you can be the best qualified fighter and still get taking out by an amateur, just the way it is sometimes.July 18, 2014 at 8:19 am #7499AnonymousInactive
Another factor and this may or may not be off subject but whatever, is the poor state of eye care in warring nations. Think about how many Americans need glasses or contacts. No compound that by NEVER seeing an eye doctor and poor nutrition. It’s amazing they can hit anything.July 18, 2014 at 4:42 pm #7518Joe (G.W.N.S.)Moderator
Another factor and this may or may not be off subject but whatever, is the poor state of eye care in warring nations. Think about how many Americans need glasses or contacts.
Definitely a factor; although the results are the same, the more negative check marks the harder it is to live through it.
It always amazes me how many here; that need eyeware to have functional vision, don’t have spare eyeglasses.July 24, 2014 at 5:23 pm #7634
A bit of a thread jack but it seems interesting and it is a video. The video deals with German tactics, but what really made me pause is the comment by Kirk following it. He seems to be a man who has been there and got the t-shirt, very thought provoking comment IMO.
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