Small Unit Tactics contact patriot-dawn Patriot Rising

Yeager HRCC: Video: Total Clown Show

Home Forums The Lounge Yeager HRCC: Video: Total Clown Show

This topic contains 35 replies, has 17 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Joe (G.W.N.S.) Joe (G.W.N.S.) 1 week, 2 days ago.

Viewing 30 posts - 1 through 30 (of 36 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #65681
    Profile photo of Max Velocity
    Max
    Keymaster

    This was sent to me by Aaron with the following quote:

    “His (Yeager’s) high risk civilian contractor (HRCC) course has always been controversial but this looks liked a MARKED turn to try teaching SUT to DKWYDK (Don’t know what you don’t know) groups. I think it’s predatory, dangerous and disingenuous in that it’s selling an experience rather than knowledge. Especially at that rate of fire. They’re having fun but not learning anything. Anyway. You have an amazing platform to warn folks.”

    This is an absolute shit show from my viewpoint as a professional soldier / trainer. Safety is a nightmare, they are all over the place, there is no control. Clearly there have not been sufficient training or rehearsals of drills. If YOU can’t see thus, and think this looks cool, then you need enlightening with professional training.

    Massive rates of fire = lack of situational awareness. The safety angles (lack of) are dangerous. In the interview segment these guys are all clearly focusing on being cool, but they have no idea, literally.

    If I had the power to stop this, I would exercise it. But in reality, this class is full of students. MVT sometimes struggles to fill professional SUT classes. Yeager is a millionaire. Absolute nuts. I am not sure many of the students in this video would have the aptitude or patience for a professional class, when they are just looking to play ‘ call of duty’ with live rounds. Or maybe they would surprise themselves, simply because they have no idea.

    It’s almost like someone watched some MVT videos, maybe even read the tactical manual and tried to implement it without the required skills to do so effectively and safely? Hmmmmm.

    Remember, Max Velocity Tactical is the ONLY school to teach Individual and Small Unit Tactics to a professional level, via a designed facility / training POI, as the primary function of our school.

    #65682
    Profile photo of Brushpopper
    Brushpopper
    Participant

    Man that must run thru a shit ton of ammo!
    Their situational awareness, or spatial awareness of where their battle buddy is is almost non-existent, several times I saw people practically run into each other. Heads are in their sights most of the time, not looking around, communication is lacking or mostly joking around. The contact drills, what I saw, was mostly turning to the target and running towards it while firing (saw two guys run into each other towards the end). I did not see anyone, may need to view it again, go prone or down on a knee into cover when coming under contact. Nor did I see any resemblance of reacting to contact as a team, forward bounds, cover fire, it was all individual “look how awesome I am mom” theatrics. May have seen some “type” of a peel, but it was pretty crappy. Definitely a shit show! :wacko:

    ~ Little - South Texas

    #65683
    Profile photo of RobRoy
    RobRoy
    Participant

    He’s probably one bullet from not being in business. I have what I think to be very good spatial awareness and what I found out in my one class at MVT that it was not as good as it should be. So imagine what is going thru some of those lunkhead’s brain groups as the excitement builds.

    Edit; I went to his youtube channel seen that comments were enabled but did not leave one at this video (954 views) simply because I am not the professional and did not want to boof up the opportunity.

    #65684
    Profile photo of JohnnyMac
    JohnnyMac
    Participant

    At first I was like, well, maybe it isn’t that bad, then:
    -no safety angles
    -“it’s like call of duty”
    -wild sprinting through objectives, at 3:53 there are guys literally just running along behind their teammates

    In the grand scheme of things, we’re most likely all on the same side. It’s just a shame that they don’t understand they are being trained at a less-than-professional level, because I’m sure that IS what they want. Hopefully they figure it out. Probably only a few will.

    I hope no one gets hurt.

    #65688
    Profile photo of Wes
    wesmc
    Participant

    Did you see the guys doing the slick pirouette moves while peeling? :wacko:

    C2G Feb 2015, CTT March 2016, CQB June 2018

    #65692
    Profile photo of Max Velocity
    Max
    Keymaster

    Other than the lack of safety angles and training, an example is on the ‘charge through’ drills. I would assume this a attempting to train a close contact drill of charging through the enemy. I could tell you, or read the TM, why even as an offensive react to contact this in itself is not a good drill – an aggressive RTR to cover, cover shoot, and then assault though would be better – because the enemy has the initiative at that point. But to the safety issue, not that of the drill itself: you see them running through not on line, and thus not staying on line together, but you also see them converging on targets. This is a basic no-no and should be drilled out in training.

    Forgetting even the ability, or not, to offer good training and drills, this training is negligent from a safety perspective.

    And he already shot someone, didn’t he? He either shot someone or there was the controversy of cameramen standing next to the targets?

    There is a money in this video where the cameramen is filming a guy from the front / side, and you can see a guy way to the rear in prone, well within safety angles. If that guy had fired, game over. If you don’t know who is doing what in drills, then people will run in unpredictable directions and into the line of fire. There are other moments where due to fine angles between shooters, a guy runs back and luckily not into the line of fire of the guy behind him,. Add to that target-focus with stream fire, you have a safety nightmare.

    What have a said and drilled about safe intervals and short bounds?

    #65693
    Profile photo of RobRoy
    RobRoy
    Participant

    Is it the high speed cool guy thing now to do SUT movement muzzle up?

    I asked that because I remember a Max video a few years ago addressing movement and then I went to the September Idaho class video and had the answer at least for trainees, muzzle down.

    #65697
    Profile photo of Max Velocity
    Max
    Keymaster

    Is it the high speed cool guy thing now to do SUT movement muzzle up?

    I asked that because I remember a Max video a few years ago addressing movement and then I went to the September Idaho class video and had the answer at least for trainees, muzzle down.

    I have no idea, but some guys think it is cool. We do muzzle down for specific safety reasons, in case of a fall – more chance of muzzle to dirt rather than sweeping someone if you fall. And it is also part of your ready-up drill. You don’t patrol muzzle up.

    We do muzzle up as part of CQB i.e. breaking up, because it is less to move the muzzle.

    I have run muzzle up and muzzle down in my time, but as stated we use muzzle down in classes for specific reasons. You tend to find with shorter weapons guys want to run muzzle up when moving in contact. Brits do that all the time with the SA80.

    I’m not going to specifically criticize a school for going muzzle up or down, but as stated we have strong reasons for muzzle down out on SUT (not CQB). Having those reasons is another reason why you know MVT has thought about the POI and safety!

    #65698
    Profile photo of RobRoy
    RobRoy
    Participant

    Yeager is creeping on his own video so I assume if you ask a legit question of things like safety angles, muzzle carriage, the running straight outta Hollywood, and seemingly skipping right thru crawl, walk and then literally running he might answer.

    #65699
    Profile photo of Dave37
    dave37
    Participant

    The only gift Yeager ever gave the world is the Hot-Crazy Matrix.

    Texas CTT/Mobility 2017, Missouri 1 Day CQB 2017, Texas HEAT 2 2018

    #65700
    Profile photo of Hessian
    Hessian
    Participant

    :wacko:

    Yeager preys upon the ignorant…

    sadly these students think they are being well trained.

    Why do people run muzzle breaks for a ‘tactical’ class with regular AR or AK? Loud and big flames out the front of ones gun is not great for concealment. :unsure:

    #65701
    Profile photo of Mike Q
    Mike Q
    Participant

    Other than the lack of safety angles and training, an example is on the ‘charge through’ drills. I would assume this a attempting to train a close contact drill of charging through the enemy. I could tell you, or read the TM, why even as an offensive react to contact this in itself is not a good drill – an aggressive RTR to cover, cover shoot, and then assault though would be better – because the enemy has the initiative at that point. But to the safety issue, not that of the drill itself: you see them running through not on line, and thus not staying on line together, but you also see them converging on targets. This is a basic no-no and should be drilled out in training.

    An interesting counter arguement to this training would be to setup a video shoot. 4 guys in ambush position – 8 guys patrolling. The ambush is sprung and the patrol must react to contact the way it is shown in the video. Then show it the MVT way. Then you compare two different reactions. Count the dead on both sides, the rounds expended on both sides, the time spent on each, etc. Make it as scientific as possible – maybe run 3 iterations of each reaction…

    Just a thought.

    There never seems to be enough time to do it right, but there is always enough time to do it twice.

    CRM Sept. 2014, CTT 1505, CTT July 2015, RC-Rifleman 1502, CP Nov. 2015, FoF March 2016, CCW May 2016, FoF Oct. 2016, FoF Nov. 2016, CLC April 2017, FoF Nov. 2017, Alumni weekend Aug. 2018, CQB Dec. 2018

    #65702
    Profile photo of Joe (G.W.N.S.)
    Joe (G.W.N.S.)
    Moderator

    …it’s selling an experience rather than knowledge.

    In itself I don’t have a issue with that, but that’s the realm of airsoft, not live fire.

    Safety is a nightmare, they are all over the place, there is no control.

    Scary beyond imagination.

    …tried to implement it without the required skills to do so effectively and safely?

    :yes:

    …we’re most likely all on the same side.

    I hope all of my potential OPFOR attend and live to this standard.

    I have run muzzle up and muzzle down in my time, but as stated we use muzzle down in classes for specific reasons.

    …as stated we have strong reasons for muzzle down out on SUT (not CQB). Having those reasons is another reason why you know MVT has thought about the POI and safety!

    For emphasis.

    Overall you can’t really counter point this insanity, the ignorant who paid for this will defend it to their last breath, which maybe sooner than they think.

    Critiquing it within our sphere works, but unfortunately bringing it to their sphere is a fools errand.

    #65703
    Profile photo of JohnnyMac
    JohnnyMac
    Participant

    I hope all of my potential OPFOR attend and live to this standard.

    I hope all my OPFOR don’t have any training! LOL

    Hopefully these guys learn about MVT.

    #65704
    Profile photo of Abacus
    Abacus
    Participant

    Yeager has an interesting following a lot like many of the more popular trainers who are internet famous. Their acolytes will defend the instructors to the last breath in part because people invest or derive a part of their individual identity into or from the things they choose to invest their time and money in. That is the root of all fandoms and explains everything from caliber wars to the fanatical loyalty some folks have towards professional sports teams.

    A portion of the typos in the above message might be my phone, the rest are just me.

    I have been wrong before...

    #65705
    Profile photo of Joe (G.W.N.S.)
    Joe (G.W.N.S.)
    Moderator

    I hope all my OPFOR don’t have any training! LOL

    In this case I think no training would be better for their individual survival. ;-)

    #65706
    Profile photo of SeanT
    SeanT
    Moderator

    No Thanks
    Not interested in getting shot. Some of those guys shoot more than MikeQ

    #65710
    Profile photo of Max Velocity
    Max
    Keymaster

    Regarding the FanDom comments, that is very interesting. For whatever reason (I hear a chorus of “because you’re an asshole Max”) MVT has never generated this sort of fan base. It’s interesting. On the one hand, that kind of fan stuff is creepy. On the other: money!

    An interesting discussion is how some of these guys generate that kind of following.

    #65711
    Profile photo of Joe (G.W.N.S.)
    Joe (G.W.N.S.)
    Moderator

    Regarding the FanDom comments, that is very interesting.

    Interesting yes, but I can’t relate to their world. I don’t get it, even though I understand the psychology.

    Many, if not most of these “popular” trainers don’t impress me at all!

    I laugh at some of their backgrounds and even the ones with legit histories aren’t teaching much more than marksmanship and manipulations.

    Sure they use euphemisms like “Advanced Gunfighter” etc…but it’s like getting your Drivers License and thinking your ready for NASCAR. :wacko:

    #65712
    Profile photo of Abacus
    Abacus
    Participant

    As far as a fan base goes, I think some of it is personality driven and a lot of it is driven by the novelty the big trainers seem thrive on. I will not call what MVT teaches boring, but it is not as eye catching as some of the silly stuff the other folks who have legions of followers seem to do. Actual legitimate training, and practice is not all that exciting. How much fun is a heavy squat? How exciting is a few hundred reps of the same dry fire drill?

    Humans thrive on novelty, that is why you have people who are barely trained to crawl, not ready to walk let alone run, sprinting around blasting away and calling it training.

    Maybe Max should get sleeve tattoos, not care as much about the quality of his material, and spend all his time generating controversy online. Or, he could keep being a professional and make a little less money but sleep better at night knowing he is not doing his students a disservice.

    A portion of the typos in the above message might be my phone, the rest are just me.

    I have been wrong before...

    #65713
    Profile photo of JohnnyMac
    JohnnyMac
    Participant

    How much fun is a heavy squat?

    Easy now. Heavy squats ARE fun.
    :yahoo:

    #65714
    Profile photo of Mike Q
    Mike Q
    Participant

    Thank you Sean. Even I was watching that and going, damn how much ammo did they go through!?

    There never seems to be enough time to do it right, but there is always enough time to do it twice.

    CRM Sept. 2014, CTT 1505, CTT July 2015, RC-Rifleman 1502, CP Nov. 2015, FoF March 2016, CCW May 2016, FoF Oct. 2016, FoF Nov. 2016, CLC April 2017, FoF Nov. 2017, Alumni weekend Aug. 2018, CQB Dec. 2018

    #65721
    Profile photo of First Sergeant
    First Sergeant
    Moderator

    @Max, he hasn’t had anyone shot but one of his instructors shot a students vehicle while jumping up and down on the students pistol. He was also the one that had the camera man down range. It was also his range that had all of the brass and shotgun hulls on it while they were trying to push a students wheelchair downrange.

    FILO
    Signal out, can you identify.
    Je ne regrette rien...
    Klagt Nicht, Kämpft

    #65723
    Profile photo of wheelsee
    wheelsee
    Participant

    5.12 is a bit frightening….and 6.30…..

    Thankful for the training that MVT provides – the quality, the safety, the process (crawl, walk, run).

    I stand by my initial eval – MVT runs THE safest range (static or dynamic) I’ve been on or involved in……

    Which is heavier - a soldier's pack or a slave's chains? Napoleon

    Strength, Honor. Maximus (Gladiator)

    If you tolerate evil, you yourself are evil.
    Col Hugo Martinez, Commander Search Bloc

    William, in The Republic - CRS/CTT 2017, HEAT 2/CQB/FonF 2018, DCH 2018

    #65727
    Profile photo of RobRoy
    RobRoy
    Participant

    From what I know of the guy he got his fame with the usual right wing tough talk shtick about gun confiscation during the Obama era.

    It’s a good old time tested tactic that draws in the conservatives like flies to fresh cow poop. I have decades of experience with the conservative tough talk, usually they abandon their “fans” after a good thrashing by the establishment/left. But it works and they cash in.

    #65729
    Profile photo of Robert
    Robert
    Participant

    No Thanks
    Not interested in getting shot. Some of those guys shoot more than MikeQ

    LMAO!! I see what you did there!! ;)

    www.jrhenterprises.com
    RMP, TC3, NODF, CRCD 6/14, CP 9/14. NODF, Land Nav, 6/15. Rifleman Challenge 9/15- Vanguard. FOFtactics 3/16, 10/16, 11/16, 6/17,11/17 CTT, 6/15, 11/16, , LRMC-1 9/17 GA Mobile CTT and DA 10/16, GA mobile DCH 3/18, HEAT1 3/18 Alum weekend 8/18, Opfor CLC 10/18, DA 11/18 CQBC 12/18

    #65730
    Profile photo of Robert
    Robert
    Participant

    Regarding the FanDom comments, that is very interesting. For whatever reason (I hear a chorus of “because you’re an asshole Max”) MVT has never generated this sort of fan base. It’s interesting. On the one hand, that kind of fan stuff is creepy. On the other: money!

    An interesting discussion is how some of these guys generate that kind of following.

    You need a basement evidently.

    www.jrhenterprises.com
    RMP, TC3, NODF, CRCD 6/14, CP 9/14. NODF, Land Nav, 6/15. Rifleman Challenge 9/15- Vanguard. FOFtactics 3/16, 10/16, 11/16, 6/17,11/17 CTT, 6/15, 11/16, , LRMC-1 9/17 GA Mobile CTT and DA 10/16, GA mobile DCH 3/18, HEAT1 3/18 Alum weekend 8/18, Opfor CLC 10/18, DA 11/18 CQBC 12/18

    #65731
    Profile photo of Lloyd
    shooter
    Participant

    I am only 3:40 into the video, and just realized I have said “holy shit!” and “what the fuck?” at least a half dozen times each.

    :wacko:

    ---

    We are all victims of our perspective.

    #65734
    Profile photo of Joe (G.W.N.S.)
    Joe (G.W.N.S.)
    Moderator

    :scratch:

    :wacko:

    #65735
    Profile photo of Darkrivers
    Darkrivers
    Participant

    HRCC + High Risk of Creating Casualties! What a shit show! :wacko:

    If you're gonna fight, fight like you're the 3rd monkey on the ramp to Noah's Ark... And Brother, it's starting to rain! James from Texas

Viewing 30 posts - 1 through 30 (of 36 total)

You must be logged in to reply to this topic.